speaking of shots...

kimberley wrote: Kaleigh is fast approaching her first vaccines and i have some questions...

none of my kids were even given prevnar because it was never mandatory until now. when i spoke to the ped about it.. he, of course, gave me the big scare talk about the "what ifs" implying it is irresponsible not to get it. did your kids get it? did you delay it? she also has to get a 5-in-1 needle that day for DPPT and HIB i believe. that seems an awful lot all at once. thanks in advance.

luvmykids replied: My kids did get it, I'm pretty sure the 5-1 at the same time. I hadn't done a whole lot of research back then and have only scratched the surface now, so I can't say if I would or wouldn't do it again. As far as the affects that day, same as any other shot day. A tad irritable, just needed xtra TLC from mom.

hth

holley79 replied: Annika is going in for the 2 month next Tuesday. I am so not looking forward to that. I know I am going to cry right along with her. I don't know what shots she is getting. I forgot to ask. All the questions I ask you would think that would be one of them.

kayla's mama replied: Kayla got all of her scheduled shots. Just a bit fussier and a low grade fever!!!

gr33n3y3z replied: What is prevnar?

kimberley replied:
that is the vaccine for meningitis. i believe the US has been giving this shot for years. we just started up here in late 2003.

ediep replied: Jason got 4 separate shots in one visit....they didn't have the 4 in 1 at that time. He was fine but a little tired and cranky for a day or so.

EvesMom replied: I guess I'm one of the lucky ones! Evelynn hasn't had any reactions to vaccines thus far, but her 6th month appointment is rapidly approaching. Hope I haven't spoken too soon.

3_call_me_mama replied:
no prevnar is for ear infection and pneumonia


HIB is the menengitis one.

HONESTLY I'd pass on them until you do more research and she's older. That is a TON of chemicals and JUNK to put into her smal body at once. Seriously. A mixed shot like those can casue reactions adn you won't know what the reaction was too until you get the shots again. I'm not tryign to scare you. just being honest from a my own experience.
Space them out or seriously do some research and figure out what ones you really believe in.

EvesMom replied:
Actually this is what the two are:
Prevnar®, you can help protect them from certain pneumococcal bacteria that can cause life-threatening meningitis and blood infections.
The Hib vaccine protects your child from the Haemophilus influenzae type b bacteria, which can cause epiglottitis (severe swelling in the throat that makes it hard to breathe), a serious form of pneumonia, and a disease called bacterial meningitis. Meningitis is an infection of the membrane covering the brain and spinal cord that can lead to lasting brain damage and deafness in young children, and can sometimes be fatal. Haemophilus influenzae can also cause serious joint and skin infections as well as other less common infections

kimberley replied: really? the ped specifically said it is for the more serious strain of meningitis and that is why he strongly recommends it because it can be fatal.

and with the 5-in-1, i either take them all or not at all. they can't/won't split them. jade had a reaction to the MMR and i brought that up to the ped saying we won't know which caused it and he said well the reaction was not life threatening so don't worry about it

EvesMom replied: Honestly, by doing a little research on the illnesses and diseases that your vaccinating your children for, you'll see that the little bit of crankiness and mild fever are well worth it. Meningitis is often fatal (it took the life of my husbands best friend when they were young) and my aunt had polio (it left her crippled).
Other vaccines such as varicella (chicken pox) are not entirely necessary. How many of us haven't had the chicken pox?

kimberley replied: yes i have never vaccinated any of my kids for chicken pox and won't likely with Kaleigh either since she will probably get them before she is old enough for the shot lol. i will try to read more on the prevnar shot... it is just new to me so i thought i'd ask and see if anyone didn't get it for some particular reason. thanks for all your advice.

3_call_me_mama replied:
I'm not going to start a debate on this but simply point out that it is simply an opinion.
It' is YOUR opinion that it is beneficial to the child ot have teh mild crankiness and fever to be protected. What if your child DIED or was in some way affected for LIFE from getting the SHOT rather than the illness? Would you feel teh same for risk factor?

It is MY opinion that the risk of the shot's side effects are not worth it to get the shot. Also do you know when the last case of polio was in the US? just curious on that one.. Do you know how many people that never got the polio vax never got polio? Curious also>:)

Kimberly- if you want to research each Vaccine i can give you links to both sides of the coin on it

3_call_me_mama replied: Also teh reason we dont' do prevnar...
kathleen had a severe reaction after her 2 month appointment form teh prevnar shot and teh DTaP shot. Severe swollen leg, high fever, a very hard spot at injecton site and difficulty breathing, vomiting, etc.
We were told by her ped that it was a reaction to the shot. considered severe and also that she should not under any ciccumstances have that hsot again. He told us the chances of her getting the diseases it was fighting agaist was far less than her having another reaction to teh shot. He also told us that nowdays the infections Prevnar would help to protect against are also medically treatible. yes people can still die form them, but far less than years ago before medical procedures advanced. And also far less than her risk of severe reaction to include death. (the more reactions you apparently have the higher teh risks of death~ his words not mine)

jcc64 replied: I caved on that one Kimberly, Corey got the prevnar. I gave the ped a choice to prioritize the vaccines in order of importance, b/c I told him I would not be sticking with their schedule and would instead be spreading them out over a long period of time. He put that one near the top, believing that the diseases covered by that particular vax were more likely to cross our path than say, polio. She did fine with it, but so did my boys, who never got it b/c that vax wasn't around when they were little. So, who's to say??? Not much help, sorry!

mysweetpeasWil&Wes replied: I just checked my files because I forget easily, but yes, Wil had the Prevnar. But I personally think those 5 in 1 shots are too new and I would demand they seperate it...sounds like your ped won't budge, then I would recommend just doing that one and do all the others at different visits.

I also held off on the polio shot until just recently at 15 months (and looking back, I wish I hadn't done it at all). We're due for the MMR and chicken pox this Monday, but again, I'm holding off. My ped doesn't like it, but I'm the parent. I also will not let Wil get more than 2-3 shots at one time.

gr33n3y3z replied:
Oh ok John had that shot before he went to college
So they are now giving that to babies now?

kimberley replied: yes it is now part of our regular vaccine schedule as well as chicken pox.

EvesMom replied: Oct 1 2005
Infection with polio virus reported in Minnesota infant
The Minnesota Department of Health (MDH) is investigating a reported case of infection with the virus that causes polio, in an infant from central Minnesota.
Not trying to start a debate. Just trying to help. No need to get defensive.

3_call_me_mama replied: I found the article that you were citing (Well not the same one this one was written teh day before regarding teh same infant child)
her's teh WHOLE article. And a few excerpts that I took out.
Polio article from the CDC (center for disease control)

(to answer teh question i asked actually stated in article)
The last wild poliovirus outbreak in the United States occurred in 1979 and was caused by a wild type 1 poliovirus. In that outbreak, 10 paralytic poliomyelitis cases and four other poliovirus infections occurred among unvaccinated Amish persons and members of other religious communities with low levels of vaccination who lived in Iowa, Missouri, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin. The source of this outbreak was traced to religious groups in Canada and the Netherlands that also had low levels of vaccination (7). A polio outbreak in 1993 in the Netherlands with 71 paralytic cases among members of unvaccinated religious communities also resulted in poliovirus transmission without paralytic disease in Alberta, Canada; no evidence of transmission from this outbreak was found in the United States (8).

Parts of teh article :
On September 29, 2005, the Minnesota Department of Health (MDH) identified poliovirus type 1 in an unvaccinated, immunocompromised infant girl aged 7 months (the index patient) in an Amish community whose members predominantly were unvaccinated for polio. The patient has no paralysis; the source of the patient's infection is unknown. Subsequently, poliovirus infections in three other children within the index patient's community have been documented. This report summarizes the ongoing investigation, provides information regarding poliovirus exposure risks and prevention measures in the United States, and offers recommendations to state health departments and clinicians.


Given the degree of difference (2.3%) from the parent Sabin poliovirus type 1 strain, the virus isolated from the index patient is estimated to have been replicating for approximately 2 years, which means the virus likely is older than the infant. OPV is still widely used in most countries; however, because OPV has not been used in the United States since 2000 and in Canada since 1997, the original source of this virus likely was a person who received OPV in another country. Neither the infant nor her family members had any history of international travel. This virus is not related to other known iVDPVs or to any type 1 cVDPVs that caused outbreaks such as those in Hispaniola during 2000--2001, the Philippines during 2001 (1), or Indonesia during 2005.


It is a long article and i won't cite it all here. It was put out buy the CDC, and it explains how not all polio virus strands are the same and cause the crippling poilo that everyone is familiar with (FDR). From my understanding, it can be similar to a FLU strand.. and have several strands that change over time not always causing teh same effects.

5littleladies replied: My kids have all had the prevnar shot (except for Lissie-she's running behind on her shots ). I didn't notice any reaction. My ped strongly advised me to get them that one because she had a child die from the pneumococcal bacteria that the vaccine protects against.

And I don't want to get into a debate here, but as far as the lack of polio outbreaks, etc, doesn't it stand to reason that the reason people don't contract these diseases anymore is because everyone is vaccinated against them? If everyone stopped getting vaccinated I would imagine certain diseases would make a comeback. JMO

3_call_me_mama replied:
Actually it was WAY on teh decline before tehy even introduced teh VAX. And it's still going in third world countries where they do get VAX. Most of teh diseases that are "prevented" by vaccines are caused by unclean living conditions. (Most diseases were rampant everywhere until plumbing was put into place. The streets used to be filled with septic and such and once those conditions were improved ALL illness were significantly reduced. (NOT saying that someone that gets anythign that could be "prevented" with a shot is living an unclean life. But that is how MOST were spread adn started. There are graphs of disease before and after introduction of vacines. I'll see if i can find them. I'm also NOT saying that vaccines may not have helped to keep them on the decline, just that they weren't the main reaosn in most cases.

EvesMom replied:
Took the words right out of my mouth.

3_call_me_mama replied: Here's the link to teh graphs
they show mortality form disease and when teh vax was introduced.
AS you can see teh diseases were on a HUGH decline anyways befreo teh VAX was introduce. And actually in one vaccine tehre was a hugh jump in teh # of deaths form the disease right when teh vaccine was introduced.

Graphs
As I stated above living conditions had improved greatly everywhere adn that reduced a TON of disease.

ETA : had to fix link (it should work now)

EvesMom replied: In 2002, WHO estimated that 1.4 million of deaths among children under 5 years were due to diseases that could have been prevented by routine vaccination. This represents 14% of global total mortality in children under 5 years of age



http://www.who.int/entity/immunization_mon...VPDs_deaths.jpg

EvesMom replied: http://www.who.int/immunization_monitoring..._AMRProfile.pdf

3_call_me_mama replied: WHO is world wide am I wrong?

How many were in the US?
How many were in underdeveloped countries that have less than sanitary living conditions? that drink from and bathe in teh same water!!!!!

I'm not going to continue this any further. I'm sorry kimberly for turning your honest concerned question into a debate. I have informed myself and made our decision for our family. If anyone wants info please PM or email me and I'll be gald to offer advice, insight ond point you to resources. Anyoen can do research on it. Believe what you want. Good luck to all with their decisions.

kimberley replied: thanks everyone for your all the information you provided me. i have read a lot of it but haven't come to any definitive conclusions as yet. i am trying to weigh both sides. i appreciate the help.