ok, and now a spinoff - Israel vs arabs...?

cameragirl21 wrote: again, no debates please, just state (if you want to) whose team you are on and why. obviously since i'm Jewish my team should be fairly obvious but please don't think you're going to offend me if you're on the other side and don't be afraid to say so.

cameragirl21 replied: oh, sorry, guys, the first one is supposed to say "because it's a democracy IN an otherwise backward region" not AND an otherwise backward region, otherwise it doesn't make sense. sorry.

jem0622 replied: I can't vote, because my feeling on it wasn't listed. I'm not Jewish or Arab or Muslim or Buddhist, therefore I would rather not pass judgement on them for being emphatic about their beliefs. They are not the only ethnicities who feel that violence is the answer to living side by side in this big, wide, beautiful world. I don't know that we (as a country) can help another in such a deep seated, historic matter. I don't think it is our place. We might feel that democracy is best for everyone, so why shove it down their throats? Guidance is one thing, but taking over and fixing the ills of other countries when we have homeless and disabled, and not enough money for the best education possible for the children of our country...I don't agree. JMHO.

CantWait replied: As far as I'm concerned it's none of our business and they should be left to fight it out themselves. They both have a big enough army.

redchief replied: The situation in the Middle East is so much more complicated than any of what was listed, encompassing all of them and more, so I null voted.

cameragirl21 replied:
Ed, if you feel i left something out then feel free to say what you feel about it, i tried to include all the variable options.
i agree it IS a complicated situation and far more complicated than those choices but i think i offered up enough choices that most people could relate to one.

redchief replied:
See my post in the original poll.

MyBrownEyedBoy replied: I didn't vote. Because this is too complicated of an issue for a simple answer. I believe that both Arabs and Israelis have rights to that particular area. I don't think that we should or can force a peace between the two. We've seen what happens when we force "peace" onto people. They blow things up. We also can't completely wash our hands of the region because we had a hand in the creation of Israel and that area is unstable enough. I don't think there is a right answer in this one.

cameragirl21 replied:
Kelly, what you're saying makes perfect sense but if you're going to look at it that way then you're essentially saying that there is no solution and this conflict will continue indefinitely because no one can really solve it.
Jewish or not, i guess the way i see it is that whether or not your cause is just or whether or not you are right is not nearly as important to what the end result should be as how you go about trying to get your desired result. i don't think it's ever ok to blow up innocent people whom you don't even know just to intimidate them into letting you have your way and that this sort of behavior eliminates the question of whether or not you are right or wrong immediately IMO.
JMO of course.

MyBrownEyedBoy replied: I hope that eventually we (as in the world) will evolve to a single civilization. However, I don't see it happening any time soon. And you are right, it's not ever okay to blow up innocents to further your cause. But is it any better to basically throw people out of the homes they've lived in for decades?

cameragirl21 replied:
yes and no. if you buy a house and never live there and rent it to me and i live there for decades, have my children there, then they rent it from you and your children and then my grandchildren live there and rent it from your granchildren and your great great great grandchild decides suddenly that he wants to live there and throws my great great great grandchild out, does it really matter how long my family has lived there if we had no legal claims to the premises other than that we lived there?

MyBrownEyedBoy replied: I don't want this to get too controversial. But what I am saying is that I feel the Palistinians do have certain rights to the Gaza strip. And I don't see where it's either fair or right to just come in with tanks one day and say, this is ours, we're taking it. I can see to a certain extent why they are mad. I also know that Israel was given that land. It's way to complex to sum up simply. I know my original post kind of rode the fence. But on this issue, I do ride the fence.

redchief replied: I don't think that's what Kelly meant at all... Not that she can't defend herself.

I believe Kelly simply feels, as I do, that the political, religious, demographic situation in the Middle East is not one that can be explained in simple terms. As usual, there are elements of right and wrong in all parties' arguments, and elements of right and wrong in all parties' solutions. You're right - in our culture it's never OK to kill for the sake of religious beliefs, but Islam is very clear in stating that it IS OK to kill for the sake of advancement of the religion. That doesn't mean that all of Islam embraces this thought process, though, any more than Christians and Jews embrace the allowances for violence in their scriptural texts.

I do believe that solutions exist for the region, but all of the parties will have to learn to compromise. Until that happens, violence will continue. I see no short term set of compromises that will put an end to the violent triangle of Islam, west and Israel.

I also don't think that the Middle East is the only political, social and inhumane hot-spot in the world today. It would be very short-sighted of us all to ignore what's happening to the kids in Asia, Indonesia and Africa. It would be a mistake for us to not pay close attention to the nuclear advancements of India, Pakistan, Libya, Iran and North Korea. Sooner or later the Latin American culture is going to demand more autonomy from us, as Venezuela and Argentina have already proven.

Cultural differences are inevitable and difficult to overcome politically. It's not that compromise is impossible between different cultures; it's that different cultures are so ideologically certain they are right, they are unwilling to think for a moment that the other side may have some valid, humanity enriching ideas.

ETA: While I was writing this typically redchief diatribe, Kelly indeed defended her position well.

cameragirl21 replied:
Kelly, i just want to say that i was not attacking you or your position on the issue and that i do respect you and your opinions very much.
and you're right this could get controversial, it's a difficult subject, even for us on the other side of the world who in all fairness, are on the outside looking in.

MyBrownEyedBoy replied:
I wasn't taking it as an attack. I typically stay out of these kind of discussions as I tend to avoid conflict as a general rule. But this one intrigued me. Still does. No harm, no foul as far as I'm concerned.

JadensMama05 replied: I don't have cable so I don't watch the news so I don't know what's going on but Im learning a lot from you guys. TBH, if it werent for you guys, I'd be completely lost as to whats going on in the world!

Kentuckychick replied:
Exactly, no solution. That's not to say that it will continue indefinitely (will one group kill off the other?) (Will one or both ever come to their senses?) Who's to know... I don't believe there's a clear cut "their religion is right" or "No, they are!" argument here.

I didn't vote anything because I don't agree with anyone. I agree with you whole heartedly that nothing is solved by dropping things and blowing people up. However, I do find it funny when people say this because, um... it's exactly what we do and innocent people do die... everyday because of us. (That's not to start a debate really, it's just the facts...)

My honest opinion is that it's no ONE religion, my opinion is that religion in general is one of the biggest roots of all evil in our world. That as long as there are so many different religions and as long as their are individuals who see it necessary to force their religions upon others, there will never be peace in our world.

Even in the United States, a country where we are free to practice whatever religion we choose, where the government is supposed to be separated from religion, it's not. We have a president who chooses to force his beliefs upon us everyday... and I'm not saying I disagree with all that he believes, but it's been the source of a lot of conflict.

So I guess my point is...
It doesn't matter who we blame... in some way, everyone involved is to blame.

Nina J replied: I'm on nobody's "team". It's a complicated situation. I couldn't pick a side to be on, there are good Israeli people and there are good Arab people. Both have lost innocent people who need not have died.

I agree with KentuckyChick