Your honest thoughts...

Boo&BugsMom wrote: I found out something the other day that really irritated me. The kids in Tanner's class are allowed to go to the bathroom once in the morning, and once in the afternoon. If they have to go another time other than that (legitimately or not) they lose 5 minutes of their recess. Not only that, but the kids are also allowed to have water bottles in class, all day on their desks!!! So, here are a bunch of kids sucking down water all day, and she doesn't think they will ever have to go other than those two times a day??? Tanner is a kid who loves his water. He could drink a gallon in one morning if you let him. Aiden too.

So...what are your thoughts? I have yet to say something to the teacher or ask her about it myself. I'm very tempted to, but I also stirred the pot the last time I "chatted" with her when I told her that I thought she was uncreative for always using detentions for punishments and that kids should be taught a 'lesson' in their consequence...and having a child sit after school for 30 minutes and read/do homework does nothing.

I know that there may be cases of kids asking to go to the bathroom every 30 minutes. However, I think it's the teacher's responsibility to take care of those situations on a case by case basis...not punishing kids because they legitimately have to go.

Calimama replied: Honestly I can't stand bathroom restrictions. If my kid has to go to the bathroom in a time other than the "designated potty times".. then so be it. She should not lose recess time over it. Now if she were going in there and playing around then I understand taking her play time away.

Insanemomof3 replied: I would tell her that she needs to only have 1 potty break a day (she is an adult after with a bigger more trained bladder) and if she uses the bathroom more times than that in a day, she loses her lunch break. I am mean. I would tell her its not fair, some days my kids go potty more often than others, you just never know whats going on in their bodies, so they need to go when they feel the need. JMO

Calimama replied: Another thing that bothers me, holding in your urine is not good for your body!! Little kids don't need UTI's because they don't want to lose recess time.

Boo&BugsMom replied: So, I'm not irrate for nothing?

Another thing that irks me is that kids NEED their recess time. Especially Tanner...he needs that exercise so he doesn't get wound up. Like I said...I think she gives uncreative punishments. This is a prime example, IMO. I don't like taking recess time away from any kids this age, to be honest. It just makes them worse when they can't run around and get fresh air. Also, the punishment should fit the crime. What does going to the bathroom have to do with recess??? They're in first grade for crying out loud!

stella6979 replied: I think you have every right to be irate and I definitely think you should say something to her. That is the most ridiculous rule I've ever heard of.

boyohboyohboy replied: I agree, that is the most stupid rule I have heard of...first off, if a child has a start of an infection and tends to need to go more often, then she is punishing them for something totally out of their control..
and what about a virus or something that also has them going more often?

I totally agree she needs spoken too..also I think that water bottles are ok if they are monitored but making sure no one is sharing them is an issue..I am surprised thats ok with the state...

she does sound like she needs a course in creativity..
who better to give it to her...!

mckayleesmom replied: UM...I would be taking that up with the principle . That doesn't sound right or healthy for any child. Being punished for going to the bathroom is the dumbest thing I have ever heard of.

msoulz replied: You are SO right about needing the recess time - especially boys. And when you have to go, you have to go!! I am sure they restrict because there are kids who "need" to go every half hour and that gets disruptive but there must be a better way. I t hrow my support completely behind you too!

luvmykids replied:
Ditto! Geez, some days I have to go more than that

Boo&BugsMom replied: Thank you ladies. This is just one of many issues I have had to deal with when it comes to his picky teacher. She expects kids to be cookie cutter, and I've had enough, to be honest. I think I will start by throwing an email to her (not literally, although I'd like to ) and see how she responds. I will simply ask her to clarify what I have been told and see what she says. Thank you.

coasterqueen replied: That is obsurd. Thank goodness our school tells you the "forms" of punishment on day one. You get a letter sent home telling you exactly what the punishments are, schedules, etc for each teacher so you know how your child will be punished. Going to the bathroom only 2 times a day.......obsurd.

Although, does Tanner go to different classes as well? Kylie goes to different classes - art, pe, computer lab, etc and so she's not in her main teacher's room all day so two times a day there would be pretty sufficient, I'd think. Not sure.

My2Beauties replied: That's bullcrud and I'd be upset as well, doesn't she know that holding in your urine can cause UTI's? HELLO LADY!?!?!??! I had a teacher who did that to us in first grade and I kept a UTI because of her. My mom would have to send notes to school in order to allow me to use the restroom when I had to go.

momofone replied: If she allows water bottles she needs to allow bathroom breaks as well.

wcs40110 replied: I would be outraged. That is not healthy and they should be allowed to have water all day and go to the bathroom any time they need. Ugh.

A&A'smommy replied: WOW that teacher is a nutball I would definitely talk to her about that. Aren't you glad you are almost done with her???

I'm surprised she hasn't had an accident problem, the teachers at the elementary school here have little bathrooms in their classrooms for that very reason

My3LilMonkeys replied: I hate bathroom restrictions like that. I had a teacher in 1st grade who refused to let anyone go to the bathroom during her class EVER (it was about an hour long class) and I remember multiple kids (including myself once ) having accidents because they just couldn't hold it.

Crystalina replied: Everybody has already said what I would say. Only nicer. If my child had to go to the bathroom and was told no or lose recess time I would have my sister watch Gabriella and have a seat in the classroom ALL DAY. Let her tell my kid she can't use the bathroom or she will be punished. Ha! Some teachers are like this only so they don't have to be bothered by the children. Case by case is good. If Peter Potty Pee-Pee Head is going just to roam the halls and goof off then he should be the one to lose recess time. Those teachers (especially this far into the school year) know which kids are legit and which are not.



Ok, I wouldn't really sit in the classroom but I would have a severe chat with her.

BAC'sMom replied:
I totally agree.

Sounds like crapola to me!

Cece00 replied:
This.

I think bathroom restrictions are ridiculous.

Just let the kid mess up before you put these crazy restrictions on them...

Some kids just have to go more or might need to go *right now*

I would certainly talk to her about it if its a problem for your son.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
Very glad! This isn't the only weird thing I have heard. Another parent told me that at one point she wasn't allowing the kids to order the hot lunches they wanted to order. She would only allow them the healthy choices (not that I mind her being an advocate for healthy eating)...so no ordering the chicken nuggets, etc. I understand that chicken nuggets are bad and not healthy, HOWEVER, if I give my child money for hot lunch (which happens rarely) he better get to eat what he wants to choose if I tell him it's ok! It's not her choice, it's between me and my kid! If the kids shouldn't have it then they shouldn't offer it. Why offer it if you're not going to let my child have it??? I think this was last year or a few years ago she was talked to about that.

Honestly it pushes me even further to want to homeschool these days. Tomorrow I am going to sit down and right her an email. When I get a response, we'll see what it says.

On the topic of different classes, yes Tanner does go to different classes for "specials" (art, music, etc.) but I'm not sure about the bathroom policies they have or how that works. They aren't in the different classes very long though.

I did ask Tanner if this has ever been an issue with him and he said no. I also told him that if it ever is he needs to tell me right away.

Hillbilly Housewife replied: I might be in the minority here - but I don't mind it.. There are rules...this is the real world, they have to learn that they can't always do what they want to do and when, and better they learn it fast.

That said.. the teachers here don't allow food/drinks when it's not food/drink time... so maybe it's less of an issue.

If they allowed the kids to drink when they wanted, then I'd expect them to let the kids use the bathroom as needed. So no, I don't think yuo're irrational in your thoughts.

jcc64 replied: I tell my own kids that if they have to legitimately go to the bathroom, they are to go whether the teacher allows it or not. I will deal with the consequences. Too often, schools function like prisons and not allowing students to deal with natural bodily functions is inhumane. The story upthread about having diarrhea during the 1 break a day rule broke my heart--I think that teacher should be forced to avoid using the restroom and see how it feels. I am completely aware that there are those students that like to take their daily hallway strolls to avoid classwork, but anyone with half a brain can deal with those situations on a case by case basis. Having an unyielding, inflexible policy around bathroom breaks is unacceptable, period. If a rule is absurd, my kids have permission to break it. I'm a firm believer in civil disobedience.

redchief replied: I see I'm going to be in the minority as well. I see absolutely no problem with setting reasonable bathroom restrictions. I also wonder at why more people don't voice an opinion on kids having a water bottle with them. What I find completely ridiculous is allowing a seven year-old to have a water bottle in front of him/her all day. Children will not dehydrate and dry up sitting in a classroom without a beverage at hand. Not having a ready beverage would also enable the youngsters' bladders to, for the most part, hold the manageable urine volume until mid-morning break, without fear of an epidemic of UTI's. That would also minimize requests for out of sync bathroom breaks for twenty or so leaky primary school children and, in my opinion, make for a much calmer atmosphere.

From all I've read, and in my experience, retention of urine doesn't normally cause UTI unless there is an underlying medical problem. Most UTI's are caused by improper hygiene. Even given that, UTI's only occur in 2 - 3 % of the pediatric population every year. There is a far greater chance of an "accident" than there is for UTI. Quite basically, the urinary sphincter can hold out only for so long, and the bladder muscles will only listen to "please wait' for so long as well.

I know that Lisa even disagrees with me on bathroom restrictions, but the almost total lack of evidence of mass incontinence and infection simply doesn't bear up to scrutiny. That being said, I think kids need to learn a little self-control. I remember my school days, and I wish I could honestly say I did NOT ask for a bathroom pass just to get a little break, but I would be lying if I did. Quite honestly the Good Lord gave us a sizable bladder so we could hold urine when it was inconvenient for us go #1, and being a little thirsty by mid-morning or lunch break hasn't been shown to be dangerous to normal, healthy kids either.

Boo&BugsMom replied: One cause of bladder infections or UTI is waiting too long to urinate. The bladder is a muscle that stretches to hold urine and contracts when the urine is released. Waiting very long past the time you first feel the need to urinate causes the bladder to stretch beyond its capacity which can weaken the bladder muscle. When the bladder is weakened it may not empty completely and some urine is left in the bladder which increases the risk of urinary tract infection or bladder infection.

Just a tid bit of info.

redchief replied:
I didn't attempt to refute that a small number of UTI's can be attributed to holding urine too long. My point was that this is a VERY small percentage of ped. UTI's, and that pediatric UTI's are generally rare in all cases, except in those cases where underlying medical conditions make a child susceptible. This is inarguable fact.

My dissension also comes from the very long history (as in as long as there has been recorded history) that shows no connection between UTI's and scholastic bathroom restrictions. We've all had to hold it a little too long, and I'd venture to guess that, except for some minor, short-lived lingering discomfort (and the absolute relief that came after voiding), that we all lived through it with no lasting effects. Even when the bladder stretches beyond normal, it doesn't chronically weaken the organ (except in the rare case where there is an underlying, disassociated problem with the bladder). Within hours the bladder usually shrinks back to its normal size in most cases. Urologists agree that while holding urine "too long" can cause discomfort, it almost never causes any serious lasting effects.

Urine, for the most part (again assuming no underlying medical conditions) is sterile and does not contain the organisms necessary for the cellular advance of disease. Again, the vast majority of UTI's are caused by poor hygiene, and in pediatrics, much more often in girls than boys. This is because the organisms that cause the great majority of UTI disease don't come from upstream, but from the exit port (fecal organisms being passed into the urethra areby far the most common pathological causes).

mom21kid2dogs replied: Though not a fan of bathroom restrictions either (especially if you add in unlimited water consumption), I certainly see why they are in place. My lovely daughter can play for a large number of hours without the need for a bathroom break but put that child in a one hour Mass and she'll start whinning 10 minutes in (She doesn't get to leave and she's never peed her pants). Ironically, after she leaves Mass and meets up with her friends, she never takes a potty break. I think for most kids it's a boredom response.

Our schools don't allow water bottles unless the classroom temperature is 85 degrees or above and then the school provides extra water. I really don't see the need for that much water during the school day.

I'm assuming the early primary grades have a short AM/PM recess break, don't they? Why can't kids who need to go, go then? Our early primary schools classroom schedules are set up to break at least every 2 hours.

Boo&BugsMom replied: Ed, I'll just agree to disgaree...even though it's apparent it can happen because people here have stated it has happened to them...and I have talked to numerous doctor's and med techs at my work about it who agree with me that it's not healthy.

I can see why there needs to be rules like this, but if you're going to set a rule in place, then use your common sense.

I would also like to know why a kid has to have 5 mintues of their recess taken away if they have to use the bathroom! That is the part that upsets me most. It's not that there are rules in place....it's how the rule is set up.

Again...this is just the straw that broke the camels back for me. There SO much more...this is just the tip of the iceberg.

jcc64 replied: Maybe our bladders were designed to hold urine for the times when it's inconvenient to go, like say, running away from a dinosaur or in the heat of a battle. But if there's a bathroom out in the hall, what's the point of asking young children to hold it in according to some arbitrary, random time-table? Kids are individuals with their own unique physiologies, and to me, bathroom restrictions are indicative of a larger mindset designed to fit them all into one, narrowly defined idea of what is right or good. Slavish devotion to rules like this exonerate the teacher from having to actually think and/or interact with kids on a case-by-case basis. Heaven forbid.
Reminder: this is coming from a teacher, with LOTS of experience with bathroom wanderers. They're really not so difficult to deal with.

TheOaf66 replied: I had a teach like this in 2nd grade who would make kids scared to go to the bathroom because of the consequences of going. So low and behold at risk of getting in trouble I sat at my desk and peed my pants and then got in even more trouble

I told this to Tanner last night and said if you have to go that bad you just go.

He said what about if I get my card flipped (punishment) I told him I would deal with that (oh so help me if she flips it)

He at my story but I told him not to make him laugh to to teach him what happens.

My2Beauties replied:
Jennie I also disagree with Ed on this one. The past two times I've had UTI's my doc has asked me if I hold it while I'm working and wait until I absolutely can't wait anymore. Sometimes I will say that I have done that, when I'm working on a project that has to get done, I'll hold it until I can't anymore and they've all told me NOT to do that because it causes UTI's. Every doc I've ever been to has told me that.

Boo&BugsMom replied: I do thank everyone for their honest opinions, even if I don't agree with all of them. I am not so much worried about a UTI, even though it's an unhealthy practice on so many levels, but upset at the fact that her rule is so messed up. I'm all for rules, don't get me wrong, but the way she has gone about structuring her rules makes me irritated. If Tanner was ever caught lying about having to go the bathroom, then I'd expect him to have his recess taken away. Lying is not ok, no matter how small a lie it is. However, if my child has to go that badly and can not hold it, and partly due to her allowing waterbottles at their desks all day...then I expect him to be able to go without being punished. I don't think that's too much to expect. When nature calls you have to answer it! Even as adults, if drinking water throughout the day, we have to go more than twice a day!

I have not emailed her. I'm not sure what I'm going to do being there is only one month of school left. I did ask Tanner a little more about it and he said he has not ever gotten part of his recess taken away for that reason. I also told him that if he ever gets it taken away for that reason then he is to tell us right away. I'm not sure about this "card flipping" thing. I'll have to ask more questions about that.

Have I mentioned how happy I am that the school year is almost over? This is one out of many irritating things we have encountered.

mom21kid2dogs replied: It's so refreshing to have a person ask for opinions and act respectfully about it!

I'm with you, not really sure it's worth the fight at this late date since he will have a new teacher next year, anyway! Good luck in whatever you decide!

redchief replied: For the record, I disagree with the teacher's five minute bathroom using penalty box violation as well. In fact, I certainly agree that her rules are silly because of the unlimited watering. I hope it was understood that I didn't agree with the teacher, because any set of rules has to be complimentary and hers are not.

I really tried not to do this, but there was much too much fun to be had to leave it be...

I agree and disagree with the interspersed points. I disagree that having rules about classroom interruption is a narrow mindset. The pressures on schools to deliver measurable scholastic results causes the need for minimizing instructional interruptions. Granting hall passes to first graders requires that the teacher monitor the whereabouts of that one child until his/her return, thereby causing interruption. That being said, I agree that sometimes a kid simply has to go or may have an otherwise unplanned event. Such requests do have to be on a case by case basis. Habitual bathroom breaks must be discouraged, else the only thing the kids would learn is how to flush the john.

Finally, I'd like to know what slavish rules should be followed, and what should not.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
No problem. I did ask for honest opinions and I meant it. I wanted to be sure I was seeing it clearly because I know I was wrapped up in being protective of my child. I can see everyone's points...even though I think some of her 'rules' are silly. As long as Tanner doesn't come home and tell me he fell victim to her 'owing 5 minutes of recess to go potty' charade, then I'll sit back and wait for the next load of crap to hit the fan.