Vent about info i got last night... - war related

Hillbilly Housewife wrote: My FIL and my MIL's brother, both of whom were guests last night for dinner, were into a big conversation about the "war" right now. Kepp in mind that they are both ex-miliatry and withdrawing pension. They were both in the military for over 20 years.

While I support the soldiers..I cannot and will not support this so called war. Our Canadian Military was sent to Afghanistan in order to help the economic and physical rebuilding of homes, businesses etc... and were "suckered in" by the US army. Now that Harper is the idiot running our country, his Pro-Bush-ness is just to much to handle...I almost vomited last night when my MIL's brother spewed out the information about how Harper and his Goonies "actually" signed an official document that Canada is in a time of War. Of course it doesn't help that Canadians are being shot upon...they do need to defend themselves, too.

How the F did Going overseas to help restructure economy and daily life turn into going to war? How the F did our idiot Prime Minister side with someone with ideas like Bush?

Again... I support the Canadian Soldiers... but I support their Peacekeepig efforts, not the forced participation in an active War. I'd like to see a copy of the document Harper signed.

Sorry if I offended anyone... but I grew up with strong military roots and it pains me to see the values of the Canadian army shot down by being forced to help attack a country rather than do it's job of helping that country rebuild.

CantWait replied: You know my view on this Rocky so I'll just agree to disagree. I fully support the role in Afghanistan and Harper...

C&K*s Mommie replied: I am happy to hear the opposing views to this subject, and that you are not skiddish about voicing them. I think too often opinions of some are skewed by those around them, so the time is not taken to know the true facts. Also, we all do not have the same thoughts with it, so there is no need to apologize, IMO, you have your thoughts and there is opposition to everything.

amynicole21 replied: Sorry our idiot suckered your idiot into this cluster-*#$&@

ZandersMama replied: I have to agree with you on this one Rocky. It makes me physically sick whats going on over there.

Edited because im half asleep and left out a few words

My3LilMonkeys replied:

gr33n3y3z replied: I will have to say this
Anyone who signed up for the miliatry at any point in their lives knew the chance of war was always there.

And like most everyone else who hates war like me included I refuse to let other countries walk on us and get away with it.

It sure would be nice for this all to end someday soon.

Hillbilly Housewife replied:
Lisa... Honey I totally agree there... I'm just still confused about who was where to begin with. Was the US in Afghanistan many years ago, and in an effort to get the US to back off, there was an attack on 9/11?Or was the attack the beginning? There is a lot of controversy surrounding that day... about just who exactly was getting back at who...

It just sucks that our Peacekeeping efforts were turned into Offensive efforts.

Please nobody get me wrong... I am very patriotic and I do support our troups as well as yours... I just don't support the idea of "war", even if it is "war on terror", or more appropriately, revenge.

Marie - I know.

Hillbilly Housewife replied:
As you know it's hard to judge tone in written words... is this sincere or sarcastic?

mom2my2cuties replied: Rocky - If I understand correctly - we had NO troops in Afghanistan before 9/11. They got picked off at us because we had troups in Saudi and had the Saudi Governments backing to have troops there. They were claiming that we were desecrating thier holy soil by being in the middle east period.

So yes - 9/11 was the start of it.

Hillbilly Housewife replied:
so was 9/11 a revenge against the us for having troups in the middle east?

I really don't want to offend anyone... i know this subject is touchy and near and dear to several hearts... and it's a bit off track from the op - which was just a vent... but it's nice to hear information.

mom2my2cuties replied: Yeah 9/11 was more or less revenge. But what it came down to - the US was in Saudi to protect Kuwait from Al Queida. *shrugs* I hate politics...And usually would rather be in blessed oblivion.

And I promise I'm not offended. We are all adults and we can express ourselves as such or we don't need to be here.

amynicole21 replied:
sincere.

jcc64 replied:


Sometimes, actually, often, we are never given the true facts, so it's pretty difficult to make an informed opinion. That is at the heart of my opposition to this war. The exact same thing happened in Vietnam- the US gov't blatantly deceived its citizenry about how badly the war was going- allowing the bodies on both sides to pile up needlessly. We never seem to learn from our mistakes.

And Rocky, your confusion about the origins of this whole mess are valid and understandable, b/c again, there has been ALOT of deception and shell games played by this administration about the politics of the Middle East. Afghanistan, and more specifically, the Taliban, was giving refuge and support to Al Queda, who, as Tish said, despise our military presence in their Holy Lands. 9/11 was one of many attacks designed to drive us out of Middle East affairs. The current administration loves to say, "They hate us for our freedom." They hate us because we keep throwing our weight around and asserting our own interests on their soil at their expense. They hate us b/c we present ourselves as the beacon of freedom while simultaneously propping up brutally oppressive US friendly regimes. The religious fanaticism is but one element of the equation. Yes, they despise some of our values and our lifestyle, but believe me, if we weren't constantly meddling in their internal affairs, the situation wouldn't be so inflamed and volatile. Unfortunately, the cat's out of the bag now.
The US mission in Afghanistan, imo, was initially justifiable, although b/c of Iraq, never properly executed or completed. Hth, Rocky.

CantWait replied:
I agree.

Rocky, one of the reasons also that so many of our troops are dying over their right now isn't because of lack of training, it's because other UN nations over there aren't available for back up. Out of the many UN countries that are in Afghanistan right now, only 6, that's right 6 are trained and able to go into the southern regions where all the fighting is right now. This leaves the Canadians stranded with no upside help except when it's time to clean up.

Hillbilly Housewife replied:
Marie... I hope you didn't think I thought the Canucks weren't trained...

Thanks for the POV and info ladies... I appreciate hearing it.

I can kind of see both sides though.

I see the side that the canadians have to involve themselves further to protect themselves...of course I do - they shouldn't be attacked for trying to help "clean up" as Marie said.

I see also that other UN members should be able to actively help... it's sad that they don't have the resources to properly train their people... but then again, better no participation at all then sending 12 and 13 year olds with guns to fight.

I also see the other side that other UN members don't want to participate... I wouldn't want to get involved in "someone else's fight" either. But at the same time, as UN members, they should be there to support their fellow members... isn't that what the members are "supposed" to do? One for all and all for one? It is indeed a sad time when only 6 members are properly trained and are able/want to send assistance.

redchief replied:
Many would say that "Peacekeeping" and going after a resurgent Taliban are pretty much the same thing. I understand many people's problems with the apparent digression of the war in both Afganistan and Iraq, but I also can't support pulling the troops out because there are bad guys intent on re-establishing power over the country. I don't believe either country is capable of standing on their own without support at this time, and the blood from the loss of innocent lives would be on all of the free world if we just bailed out on them.

Boo&BugsMom replied: I do not have an opinion about the war in general. The reason being is that I am not President Bush or anyone else in Washington so I do not know what it is like having to make a decision like this and be in their shoes. Until I do, I wont have an opinion so I guess that wont ever happen because I would hate being responsible for an entire country. I am sure it's not an easy job what they have to do and they are only human and can only do so much. I believe it is sad that many have lost their lives, but it was their choice to enlist in the armed forces, nobody forced them into it, and those possibilities are made known when you do register. I do hope it can end soon. I may not have an opposition or non-opposition to the war, but I still don't like war in general. I do appreciate all of those over there who are sacrificing their lives for ours. I can't say I would be brave enough to do it myself.

Rocky, I can see why you are confussed. I think it's natural to be.

CantWait replied:
Not at all, I should have worded that differently.