Super Kid - Too Much?

bawoodsmall wrote: My husband rose an interesting subject to me this morning and I was wondering where all of you stood. He says we are all(the world as a whole I guess) trying to raise Super Kids and aren't just letting kids be kids. For instance I put the kids in activities and he never did any of those as a child and he is fine. What do you guys think...are we pushing our kids to much?

luvmykids replied: Yes and no. I think it's getting harder to be a kid...there is so much competition over who started what at age two and therefore will be a superstar at it by the time they're five I know that's dramatic, but it seems like we're creeping up on that kind of thinking.

I think it's fine to allow kids to do things, IMHO it's just important that there is balance and I try to make sure my kids have tons of unstructered time to just PLAY.

I've been thinking about this a lot lately, after seeing the twins' daily schedule. They are SO busy from the second they set foot in the school, and only get three 15 min. recess periods. It's because they're trying to cram in every aspect of education from the alphabet to computer science Part of me is glad, because in reality, since that's just how it is these days, they'd be behind otherwise. But part of me feels like "It's KINDERGARTEN for petes sake!"

moped replied: I do think that a majority of people are doing that - oerscheduling etc, but it isn't always a good thing - IMO.

I have the philosophy to let kids be kids - to this day Jack has never been registered in anything, we don't do pre school yet, etc..........

I have a pile to say but really don't need to

redchief replied:
Please, understand that since I know nothing about your style of parenting, my answer is in general and based upon my observations.

Yes. Not only are our children being pushed too hard academically and physically, we're requiring maturity beyond their ability to provide. This results in an academically and/or physically dominant child who doesn't understand his or her limitations and has an egocentric outlook. This becomes obvious as we see children we thought to be extremely intelligent delve themselves into the darker sides of college life upon their release from the proverbial apron strings of parental control and the micro-world built by the parents to exercise that control.

These kids become self-centered and are genuinely surprised to learn their actions have consequences that may affect their lives forever. Some manage to get through this time but many remain "children" for many, many years into adulthood, relying on mom and dad to bail them out of any situation they get themselves into. Why do parents do this? They rightly blame themselves for the children they've created and thrust into the world for us to deal with. When will they force their children to stand on their own? Not until death takes them from this world in most cases I fear. For this isn't so much about creating super kids as it is about boosting the egos of parents who feel their offspring are better, genetically and environmentally, than those produced by others.

What a shame, when the best education the world has to offer is the unbridled world itself. Unfortunately these kids shall never see it, even when they're old enough to let go of their parents' hands. Their perception at that point lacks the innocence of childhood necessary to see the greatness of the place into which they've been born. Their narrow view of the world, forced upon them by overindulgent and obsessed parents will be all they are ever able to see. And the beat goes on.

moped replied:
WOw Ed - very impressive!~

I feel the same way

Boo&BugsMom replied: I have a lot to say about this subject as a parent and as an educator. BUT...I wont because I wont be able to stop typing! I'll just say YES, I do think we push kids too hard now a days, in everything, esp acedemics. I also think our education system is too "cookie cutter". Children are all so different and on so many different levels, some kids who are labeled LD really are not, when it's the education system who is putting children at risk for advancement because of the consistant pushing. Challenging a child is wonderful, but pushing a child is not. Our system has gone from challenging children, to pushing them, resulting in many children being left behind...NCLB my arse. I could go on and on...but I'll stop there.

bawoodsmall replied: Ok. I think we kinda all agree. Ed sees it exactly like Jacob. Most of us do it though, right. I feel that if we dont then unfortunately our children will be left behind. You have to know so much nowadays just to get into kindergarten and you want your child to be the best at EVERYTHING. It's sad but I dont see any way around it.

My3LilMonkeys replied: I try not to push my kids too hard - lots of free play time, no activities or preschool yet. I try to teach them a lot of things at home, but if Brooke doesn't feel like doing her alphabet today, no big deal - we skip it. Part of me does worry that they'll be behind when they start school if I don't push them a little more, but they'll catch up eventually.

momtoMegan&Alyxandria replied: I agree on most all of the points brought up tonight.

Ed great assessment of the situtation. And an educator is agreeing as well

I won't add too much more other than:
There's a statement Megan made the second day of school in the 1st grade (which she was in twice since she struggled a little with her reading..better to repeat now than later). I asked her if she learned a lot and she said, "yes mom, but you really should have put me in pre-school". All I could say was I'm sorry I didn't realize things had changed so much.

A&A'smommy replied:
I completely agree with Ed, very well said!!

I'm the same way if alyssa doesn't want to do it then I don't push her, I think it takes away from the fun of learning (especially when we BOTH get frustrated). So we don't have a schedule, we just play and read and watch a few cartoons and try to have a fun day.

MommyToAshley replied: I agree to some extent, but not completely. Letting the kids have free time is good, but not all structured activities are bad.

Ashley wants to try everything, and I do put her in a variety of activities. Before she started kindergarten, I limited it to three. But, now with school, I think I will limit it to just two activities. I am glad that she had the opportunity to try different activities, how else is she supposed to know that she preferes dance over soccer?

Team sports and individual sports can all teach children a variety of life lessons. Kids learn social skills such as cooperation and team work. Before Ashley even started preschool, she learned how listen to instructions and to take turns in gymnastics class. Since she was an only child, taking turns was a new concept to her. Through sports, kids learn discipline that often lead to confidence and greater self-esteem. I am not talking about confidence from being the first place winner, but the sense of accomplishment when they master a skill for the first time ... all on their own. I remember the first time Ashley learned how to do a flip over top of the bar in gymnastics. She had tried and tried for months, and when she finally did it, she jumped up and down and with the biggest smile on her face, she said, "I didn't give up and I DID IT!!! The focus was on her efforts, she was as proud of herself for not giving up as she was for accomplishing the task.

And, let's not forget the physical excercise is good... especially at a time in society when the TV, game consoles, and the computer take the place of outside time.

I think it's when the parents make it all about being a competition that there are problems. It's the parents that push their children to be #1 that take the fun and learning out of the sport or activity. That's why I look for organizations that don't dwell on being the best or #1. I steer away from the competitive sports, activities, and pageants. The soccer league Ashley was in last year didn't even keep score. They focused on learning the skills and working together as a team. I put her in a ballet program that was a little more relaxed and taught the skills in a fun atmospher that fostered a love of dance as opposed to some of the stricter programs that catered towards teaching those that will move on to become professional ballerinas.

So, I don't think you can lump all extra-curricular activities together, just like you can't lump all kids in the same group. It's about having balance in your life and supporting your child's interests without imposing any of your own expectations on them. There's a big difference if you ask me. However, your DH may see me as one of those parents that over-schedule their child.

jcc64 replied: Great points, Ed and Dee Dee. I agree, though I could probably be accused of 'over-scheduling' my kids. That is, I allow them to do that to themselves and to our family. My oldest ds is an avid, or even rabid, baseball player, and we spent virtually EVERY w/e this summer attending one tournament or another with this team or that. He had very little unstructured time this summer, by his own choosing. It would have been easier, and certainly cheaper, if I said no, but I couldn't do that to him. He led the way, and I facilitated it.
When I was a kid, summer meant hanging out in the woods with friends or swimming wherever- but it's a different world now. I can't impose my concept of what a perfect childhood should be on my kids. This is all they know. And fwiw, when I was a kid, there was no cable, no playstation (though there was Atari), no computers or internet, no vcr's even. So, we didn't spend nearly as much time inert and indoors, engaged in solitary activities.
So, all of this over-scheduling is a double edged sword. I am sad that kids don't seem to get a chance to ripen naturally, that every wrong turn is a potential blight on the all important march toward a college acceptance letter. How do we learn if not by making mistakes?

redchief replied: Dee Dee, I totally agree that structured activities and team sports are not only good for kids, they're nearly vital to emotional and physical development. It is in structured activities that children learn how to follow instructions and begin to understand the importance of rules. It is in team settings that kids learn how to become part of a group working toward a common goal. These concepts, without examples, would be difficult for children to grasp.

Team play and structured activities also enable children to learn how to win and lose with dignity, but even more important, kids learn such life skills as cooperation and disagreement resolution. It's when parents insist their child must be the best, the captain, the leader, the big cheese all of the time, then they're pushing too hard.

grapfruit replied: I think there's a difference b/w participating and over scheduling. I've seen some kids out there (even in my "generation") that were in activities that they didn't want to be in, they were "forced" or at least pushed. I think that's over scheduling.

As for the rest, I think yes. School is a lot less of a learning environement then it is now. The teachers don't have time to make learning fun b/c they're spending all their time teaching the cookie cutter ciriculumn (sp?).

I remember in 6th grade we raised fruit flys to learn about biology. We made up a new civilazation and "buried" it to learn about archeology and history and even math. This same teacher had us build a huge (and I'm so going to spell this wrong) rombicosdodeahedron out of cardboard (basically a big 100 and some sided "shape") that you could go in, and then we donated it to the Kindergarteners as a play area. We had a "micro city" w/police officers and rules and if somebody broke a rule we would hold mock trials. I was lucky enough to have that teacher 3 times (he was the gifted teacher my 3rd and 4th grade years and then my "regular" 6th grade teacher). I learned about eclipses, deductive reasoning, basic chemistry, medevil times, and countless other things. And you know what, it was fun...imagine that...

redchief replied:
Where can the world find more teachers like this?

MommyToAshley replied:
I will probably follow your lead as Ashley becomes older. If there is a sport or activity that she is passionate about and chooses to allocate her free time to it, then I will support that as long as it doesn't interfere with her grades. And, of course, at that age, sports are more competitive, but then our children are more mature. And, as Ed said, there is a lesson in learning to win and lose with dignity. (Ashley is not so good at the latter, but we are working on that)

coasterqueen replied: I agree with Dee Dee.

Kylie wants to be in everything right now. I've even had to tell her no because we already have so much to do with activities. As long as SHE wants to do the things she's doing I will continue to let her.

I think it's when parents force kids into activities that it is wrong. If I was putting Kylie in all these activities and she didn't want to be then that would be a problem.

I think it's great when they get to do several things and eventually as they get older I'm hoping my kids, at least, will decide on only a few and decide on the right ones for them.

It could be on the other end of the spectrum like my parents were and wouldn't let me do ANYTHING. I had to beg and plead to do anything when it came to extra curricular activities.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
Yep, I agree. Our rule is you have to be involved in something, but you get to chose what it is. I think it's important to keep kids active and be a part of something that "they" enjoy, but not overworked.

Also, I know for me personally, my extra curricular activites is what kept me going in school. I looked forward to doing them and I knew I couldn't do them unless my grades were up.

coasterqueen replied:
With Kylie's tip-toe walking we HAVE to keep her active or else we'll be forced to do casts on her. If we don't keep those muscles worked out in her heels then we'll have serious issues on our hands. We are hoping that her being in certain activities will help - some activities like soccer and gymnastics are working those muscles out even more. Luckily for us she asked to do those activities. She does want to do some extra activities like art classes that don't give her the exercise she needs, but she wants to do them so I let her.

grapfruit replied:
See if I was a teacher, that's how I'd want to be. But he was an "old school teacher" and I think these "new teachers" have a lot of restrictions. Thank you NCLB...

bawoodsmall replied:
Dee Dee - I do agree with you on most aspects. My dh never had a chance to do all those things because his mom was a single parent most of his life and quite frankly the money was not there at all. Not just she didn't want it to be there. Structured activities are a good thing. I am all about structure, and you do learn so much from them. I am not even sure he is talking about all the sports and stuff. He just means that as a whole general society is expecting a heck of a lot more academically out of our children than even 10 years ago. What ever happened to learning about life lessons through playing with your friends in the yard?

noimthesister replied: I'm struggling with this as well, trying to find E's first activity. I think another aspect of this is the increasing number of single-child families and the fact that we can't really let kids run and play outside by themselves in many neighborhoods anymore. Putting them in activities is the only way they get to socialize. I think Girl/Boy scouts or mixed sports camps are better ideas for "grab bag" kids that want to do everything than scheduling 3-6 activities a week, though.