Organic -- is it really healthier?

MommyToAshley wrote: Ugghhh, I hate this! I have been doing some research on organic and non-organic foods, and I have to say I am confused.

I have been buying organic meat that is hormone and antibiotic free because I thought it was better for us. And, it is more expensive. Well, then I read this article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1770

I've read a dozen others just like it on organic vegetables. Scary Stuff!!!

Then, I read the articles on non-organic food and they talk about the dangers of antibiotics and hormones in the meat, pesticides in the vegetables. Again, Scary Stuff!!!

I don't think anyone knows WHAT is really healthier for us. I don't know what to do... I just want us to be able to eat safe food.

I guess I am just venting out loud, and sort of looking for your thoughts as well. I know we have talked about organics here before, but the more I read the more I have come to the conclusion that none of our food is safe.

gr33n3y3z replied: I know what you mean
Is it healthier I would say yes to a certain point.
Beyond added Hormoans in milk and other things its all the same

luvmykids replied: I think it's so frustrating that you can basically find good arguments on either side, and then you're still no more sure one way or the other. I know strong advocates of organic who insist it's the only way to go, others who will tell you there isn't a big difference, and even more folks on the fence.

Sorry, I took over your vent

Cece00 replied: Honestly, I dont think organic is all its cracked up to be, and I sort of even think its a gimmick. I dont buy into it at all, and other than the organic meat my parents give us for FREE b/c they own cattle (otherwise I'd buy regular meat) I never, ever buy organic.

kimmylyn replied: The only thing I buy organic is milk. My oldest son had severe acne as a baby. So bad they classified it as teenager acne and put him on some really heavy duty medication which I hated to put on him.

I then decided to stop the medication all together and switch to organic milk. His face has never looked better. It will never be 100% because the acne he had left scars, but his face is so much better.

Not sure if that helps, but it is the only two cents I have to give..

luvmykids replied: I do admit that organic milk and yogurt taste incredible, when I do spend the money on organics those are the things at the top of my list

jcc64 replied: Buying organic doesn't mean that you are completely excused from the hazards of food contamination. One of the ecoli outbreaks this past summer came from organic spinach. Unhealthy bacterias live on other living things- if you happen to be the unfortunate one that eats one of those things, organic or not, you're gonna get sick.
Having said that, I am absolutely certain that eating organic is a healthier lifestyle, and in no way a gimmick. BY LAW, organic farmers have to adhere to a strict set of rules in order to utilize the organic label. Chief among them is the absence of pesticides, growth hormones, antibiotics,etc. If there were no other benefits, and there are, that would be reason enough for me to eat organic. Many many pesticides and other "farm-a-ceuticals" have long been linked to cancers, especially the blood born ones that affect kids. Growth hormones have been definitively linked to un-naturally premature adolescence. And in the end, organic food tastes better to me.
I could go on and on. There are plenty of interested parties that have a stake in discrediting the organic movement. If people want to believe that organic is a scam, that's their prerogative. For me and my family, I'm very happy to make the economic sacrifices necessary to insure that my kids are ingesting as few man-made chemicals as possible. Without knowing anything more specific than that, I'm very comfortable with my decision.

Cece00 replied:
Organics can not be grown with CONVENTIONAL pesticides and other chemicals. Not that NONE can be used.

>>Organic foods are produced according to certain production standards. For crops, it means they were grown without the use of conventional pesticides, artificial fertilizers, human waste, or sewage sludge, and that they were processed without ionizing radiation or food additives.[1] For animals, it means they were reared without the routine use of antibiotics and without the use of growth hormones. In most countries, organic produce must not be genetically modified.


>>* Pesticide use: While organic agriculture aims to keep pesticide use to a minimum, it is a common misconception that organic agriculture does not use pesticides. Some pesticides used on organic farms contain the heavy metal copper, which can lead to copper accumulation in the soil. Other pesticides that are approved for use by organic producers include ryania, sabadilla, and rotenone.[41]The botanical pesticide sabadilla is toxic to honeybees, and according to the California Department of Environmental Protection its mammalian toxicology has not been fully studied.[42]


>>It is claimed that organic food is more natural and that its reliance on natural chemicals makes it safer than food grown with the help of synthetic ones. This is nonsense. There is nothing wholesome about natural chemicals like ricin or aflatoxin or botulinum toxin, or especially dangerous about synthetic chemicals like the sulphonamides, isoniazid that cures TB, or the painkiller paracetamol.

>>ON THE OTHER HAND, organic farmers are bound to an ideology that demands they only use natural techniques. In some cases, such purism gets in the way of practices that are better for the environment and more sustainable for farmers. For example, organic farmers will use litres of BT spray (BT is a 'natural' pesticide made by the bacterium Bacillus thuringiensis), yet they often demonise the genetically modified (GM) cotton crops that carry an inbuilt supply of BT, and which therefore require less spraying.

>>Organic farmers source nitrate from manures, gradually broken down by soil organisms. They use only naturally-occurring products to control pests, such as the elements sulphur and copper; pyrethrins and rotenone (both made by plants); BT spray and Spinosad (both made by bacteria). However, these natural pesticides are not harmless. For instance, sulphur irritates the lungs, and rotenone has been shown to cause Parkinson's disease in rats.


>>Even the freshest organic apples – as well as other plant foods – contain natural compounds which, when extracted and given to rats in high doses, cause tumours. Toxicologist Bruce Ames of the University of California became famous in the 1970s for sounding the alarm on the cancer-causing (or carcinogenic) potential of man-made chemicals.

But after testing 'natural' pesticides in rats, he called off the warning. A paper he published in 1990 said it all. Entitled, "Dietary Pesticides (99.99 per cent All Natural)", it reported that in a regular diet, people consume about 10,000 times more natural carcinogens than synthetic ones. According to Ames, a single cup of coffee contains more natural carcinogens than a year's worth of the pesticide residues eaten on fruit and vegetables.


>>PESTICIDES HAVE ALSO grown safer as regulatory authorities raise the bar and chemical companies oblige. In August 2006, after a 10-year review of pesticide safety, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) recommended cutbacks on the use of several pesticides – but these were overwhelmingly to protect against accidental workplace poisonings. "For the chemicals that are currently listed, I'm very confident that there is no risk to the general population through the diet," says Jim Jones, director of the agency's pesticide program.


Plus there is always the worry of things that are SOLD as organic actually BEING organic. Obviously unless you grow it yourself, you never know.

>>A large percentage of the organic fruits and vegetables sold in the United States, United Kingdom, Canada and Australia are grown in other countries such as Mexico, Central America, South America and South East Asia. These crops are commonly sprayed with insecticides that are forbidden in the destination country. The fruits and vegetables are falsely classified as organic and routed through several middlemen before reaching the destination country. Not only are they not organic as classified, but they may have been sprayed with illegal cancer-causing insecticides. They may also contain toxic heavy metals.



Just something for everyone to think about.

Maddie&EthansMom replied: I feel better eating organic. Especially fresh fruits and veggies, meat and dairy products.

I do believe it is better/healthier.

Calimama replied: Everywhere you look there are articles, websites, blogs etc that voice one opinon or another. I could post 3 pages of why people think it's NOT any healthier, or I could post 3 pages of why people think it IS healthier. It's easy to find an argument for either side. I believe it's better for you to an extent. Is it perfect? Not even close. I do feel a difference when I started eating less processed and more organic foods. We've cut out a lot of boxed and canned foods, unnatural sugars etc and are really happy with the outcome. It boils down to researching and doing what YOU feel is best for your family. People can call it nonsense and tell me I'm wasting money until they are blue in the face, but I do what I feel is best for my family.

Mommy2Isabella replied:
DITTO!!

We do all organics, and they to us taste better! I make our bread when I can and we try to do other things to live what we consider healthier!!

bawoodsmall replied:
I always gave the kids organic when they were infants but not anymore. I would love to do organic but not in the price right now. Sometimes I feel like they are lucky they get fed. You ladies always keep me informed.

MyBabeMaddie replied: I LOVE Whole Foods but seriously that place is way expensive -

With the whole "superbugs" as long as you cook your meat thoroughly you should kill off the bacteria - With a few exceptions most bacteria will die at temps around 160*F. Everything has bacteria no matter what.

MotherForever2043 replied: Most of the food I buy is organic, but sometimes I by the un-orgainc food. I personally think it's healthier. Jordan's baby food is organic, but I don't think I would go tot the extent of buying organic clothes.

jcc64 replied: Crystal-
Just curious where your information came from. Can you provide a direct link? I'm not one to accept information like that as legitimate unless I know who's behind it.

Another reason to eat organic- lack of antibiotics. We wouldn't be having all of these issues with MRSA and other drug resistent staph in our schools and elsewhere if we weren't all chronically ngesting antibiotics in the food supply. It's your prerogative to eat and feed your kids whatever you want to, but we are ALL paying the price for unhealthy agricultural practices, whether we eat organic or not, and I for one, resent it.

jem0622 replied: I think my concern is the lack of standards/checks and balances in place. This goes for organic and non-organic products.

I could go off on a tangent about how all dairy is not good for humans. And how meat isn't either. You don't find hormones in grains. They are the best for you. I do realize that some have allergies...but there are other alternatives that work.

Fruits and veggies? Organic or not...just wash them thoroughly and eat. Beans? Wash and eat. The things we should eat are really what's best for us.

Without knowing the producer of anything organic, I don't know if I am getting what I hope to be paying for.

I'm just going to focus on ensuring that the kids understand moderation and a balanced diet. We have such a tremendous problem with that.

Just my two cents worth.

MommyToAshley replied:
I agree... this is the problem I am having, there are arguements on both sides.

This article http://www.cosmosmagazine.com/node/1567 was interesting. In one example, the organic farmers and farmers using modern technology are putting the exact same thing on their cotton crops... one was just doing it when they seeded and the other was spraying it on. But, only the farmers that sprayed it on called their products organic. In this case they were the exact same thing.

I think I would even be ok with paying a little extra for a that product was equally safe, and tasted better. So, while taste is an issue, it's not my main concern. My concern is I am wondering if it is safter or more harmful. Some articles, like the first one I posted, and many others that talk about the dangers of organic farming and say it is actually more dangerous because you are using live manuer which can have ecoli present (thus the recall we had recently with spinach and lettuce). I buy organic and hormone free products for safety and health reasons... but I wonder am I actually buying something that is more harmful?

mysweetpeasWil&Wes replied: I think organic is healthier, plain and simple. I agree with you Dee Dee, it's hard to really be sure now that it seems like anyone can label their food "natural", but not everyone can use the label 100% organic. Look for that little green symbol. Go to farmers market or local green stands if possible. I think it comes down to finding foods that are direct from the source - foods that have the least amount of transit from farmer to retailer, cutting out the middle-man. I know it's hard, but if you think about processed foods, that very thing you're putting in your mouth has been cooked, pushed through a machine, touched, packaged, boxed and shipped, and touched again, and then stocked by about 100 or so hands. Gross. And I agree with Jeanne about the use of antibiotics and hormones. Again, gross.

coasterqueen replied:
Well said. I am very comfortable in my decision as well, to go with organics. Everyone has to decide for their self, weigh all the factors and live with it. Ryan and I feel like we are doing the best possible thing for our girls by buying organics.

coasterqueen replied:
Well said again, Jeanne.

coasterqueen replied:
Rae, you touched on a point that I wanted to make as well. One may not be sure what they are getting organic as well, BUT if you go with local growers and establish a close relationship with them, you won't have to be unsure about what they are doing. We know our farmer VERY well and have seen the process first hand. Our farmer has made his customers like one big family. We have a cook-out every year, we speak on a very personal level in our monthly emails between customers and our farmer, etc. I think this is important in knowing what you get.

The goat farmer we used to get our goats milk from and my MIL still does -- we've watched her daily process of how she does what she does to give us milk. We've had lunch with her in her home. We know some of the same people she does, etc. We've developed and maintained a close relationship with her as well.

I believe doing this is just as important when buying organics -- closer to "home" is the key. I like knowing that I play a big part in the foods that go into my children. We know the people growing them, we have a close relationship with them and that's a heck of a lot better than putting my trust into big huge corporate farmers who only care about the bottom dollar and who you have absolutely NO relationship with. That's not someone I want to put my trust in or my kids lives to.

DansMom replied: It looks like the article in the OP was in Great Britain. I've never heard of that particular bacteria---just wondering if this is more prevalent there? They also may have different standards they apply to their labeling.

I believe that organic food is healthier in terms of additives, and that, like Jeanne said, bacteria can be a problem for any type of food. I buy organic most of the time. The locally farmed meat I buy is not certified organic, but it comes from small farms. The beef and pork are super-fresh and delicious, which I like. I've never gotten sick from these meats.

bawoodsmall replied: I agree with Rae and Karen. I think it is most helpful when you can buy from people in or close to your community where you can weed out the middle man kwim. I wish we did organic..hey there could always be a start..I will try milk. Dh works at a dairy so I dont know how that will fly..he make take it personally.

Boo&BugsMom replied: I put this debate in the same classification as vaccinations. The more I read, the more I am confused.